January 04, 2022
'The Godfather Part II'
The Ringer's Bill Simmons, Sean Fennessey, and Chris Ryan are joined by writer and filmmaker Brian Koppelman to keep their friends close but their enemies closer as they honor the greatest movie ever made, 'The Godfather Part II,' starring Al Pacino, Robert De Niro, and Robert Duvall, directed by Francis Ford Coppola.
Cast
Al Pacino as Michael Corleone
Robert De Niro as Young Vito Corleone
Robert Duvall as Tom Hagen
John Cazale as Fredo Corleone
Diane Keaton as Kay Corleone
Talia Shire as Connie Corleone
Lee Strasberg as Hyman Roth
Michael V. Gazzo as Frankie Pentangeli
James Caan as Sonny Corleone
G.D. Spradlin as Senator Pat Geary
Danny Aiello as Tony Rosato
Bruno Kirby as Young Clemenza
Frank Sivero as Young Genco
Troy Donahue as Merle Johnson
Joe Spinell as Willie Cicci
Mariana Hill as Deanna Corleone
Dominic Chianese as Johnny Ola
Tom Rosqui as Rocco Lampone
Directed by: Francis Ford Coppola
Written by: Francis Ford Coppola, Mario Puzo
Cinematography by: Gordon Willis
Music by: Nino Rota, Carmine Coppola
Notes
- The central mystery of the film: who opened the drapes in Michael's bedroom before the assassination attempt? Theories include Fredo opening them, Fredo giving house plans to Johnny Ola's people, or it being a directorial convenience. An alleged original script line has Hagen saying 'Fredo thought it was going to be a kidnapping, not a hit.' The hosts cannot resolve this after 300+ viewings.
- Bill's signature take: 'Fuck you' to the idea of remaking this as prestige TV.
- $30 million budget; grossed $88 million (7th highest-grossing film of 1974).
- 11 Oscar nominations, 6 wins: Best Picture, Director, Supporting Actor (De Niro), Screenplay, Score, Art Direction.
- Art Carney winning Best Actor over Pacino (and Nicholson for Chinatown) is discussed as one of the biggest Oscar travesties ever. John Cazale not being nominated for Supporting Actor is also cited as a major snub.
- Coppola demanded Robert Evans be removed from production, the San Francisco Opera, The Great Gatsby screenplay, and The Conversation as conditions for making the film – the ultimate heat check.
- Richard Castellano (Clemenza) refused to return, demanding to write his own dialogue; Michael V. Gazzo was cast as Pentangeli one day before filming.
- Marlon Brando was supposed to be in the flashback ending scene but didn't show up; they rewrote it to have him in 'another room.'
- The Sopranos connection: Dominic Chianese (Johnny Ola) later played Uncle Junior. The show is described as 'the 2.0 version' of the Godfather generation of mob stories.
- Danny Aiello ad-libbed 'he had lived' because he needed a line to get his SAG card; revealed this on Gilbert Gottfried's podcast.
- Talia Shire suggested changing Kay's miscarriage to an abortion; Coppola loved the idea.
- James Caan returned as Sonny only if paid the exact same amount as the first movie.
Categories
Roger Ebert's review
Quote from Rog's review:
“The flashbacks give Coppola the greatest difficulty in maintaining his pace and narrative force, a structural weakness from which the film never recovers.”
- Ebert gave it only 3 stars initially, despite calling it 'a master of mood, atmosphere and period.'
- He later amended this in his Great Movies book – one of the rare cases where he admitted he got it wrong initially.
Most re-watchable scene
- Bill: Senator Geary negotiating with Michael – 'My offer is this: nothing.'
- Chris: The Havana sequence, specifically Michael and Fredo at the cafe in Cuba.
- Brian Koppelman: Fredo vs. Michael in Tahoe – 'I can handle things... I'm smart.'
- Also discussed: Hyman Roth's Moe Greene speech, Vito killing Don Fanucci, 'I know it was you Fredo' kiss, Hagen and Pentangeli's bathtub/Roman Emperor scene, the abortion scene, the three-part death montage, and the flashback ending.
What aged the best?
- Bill: The bathtub scene – Hagen telling Pentangeli about how Roman families were treated if they cooperated.
- Chris: The way it looks – Gordon Willis's cinematography, De Niro and Pacino in their prime.
- Brian Koppelman: The bathtub scene.
- Also discussed: Young Pacino and De Niro in the same film, Merle asking for a cocktail in Michael's office, Michael's IBM stock investment, Pentangeli's brother from Italy (the evil eye), the evocation of turn-of-the-century New York and Ellis Island, Talia Shire's performance.
What aged the worst?
- Bill: Kay Corleone as a character – 'poorly constructed character' (Brian and Chris disagree).
- Rocco's assassination plan for Hyman Roth – no exit strategy.
- The dead sex worker scene with Senator Geary.
- The 'Michael Corleone says hello' line – doesn't make narrative sense.
Over-acting award
- Bill: Drunk Frankie Pentangeli asking for help with the Rosato brothers – the blazer scene, 'the old man had too much wine.'
- Brian: Deanna Corleone screaming in the woods.
- Also mentioned: The bongo player at the Cuban sex show.
Apex Mountain
- Francis Ford Coppola – maximum power, demanding the Opera, Great Gatsby, and The Conversation.
- Robert De Niro – announced himself as the next major movie star.
- Al Pacino – greatest performance discussion.
- John Cazale, Gordon Willis, Mario Puzo, Lee Strasberg, Paramount, G.D. Spradlin all discussed as apex mountain candidates.
- Mafia movies – apex mountain for the genre.
- Movies – apex mountain for the medium itself.
Casting what-ifs
- Coppola suggested Martin Scorsese to direct; Paramount rejected it.
- Elia Kazan was considered for Hyman Roth – his shirtless meeting inspired the shirtless Roth scenes.
- James Cagney was offered a part (possibly Roth); refused.
- Peter Sellers was considered for Hyman Roth.
- De Niro was almost Paulie in the original Godfather; also read for Sonny and Michael.
- Robert Duvall was not in Godfather 3 due to salary dispute ($5 million); hosts say Paramount should have paid him.
- Winona Ryder was supposed to play Mary in Godfather 3 instead of Sofia Coppola.
Re-casting couch
- Bill: Harvey Keitel as Genco (though Keitel isn't Italian – neither is James Caan).
- Chris: Joe Pesci could have played Genco.
- Bill: Bruno Kirby's part (young Clemenza) could have been played by Pesci.
- Discussion about recasting Kay Corleone with Meryl Streep.
Picking nits
- How does young Vito go from being a mute/traumatized boy to navigating Ellis Island and surviving New York alone?
- Clemenza's death is hand-waved with 'that was no heart attack' – deserved more explanation.
- The drapes issue – who opened them before the assassination attempt?
- Sonny's punch of Carlo in the first movie misses by seven feet; this movie has a more realistic punch (Pacino hitting Keaton).
Half-assed (internet) research
- In an early script version, Tom Hagen was having an affair with Sonny's widow.
- G.D. Spradlin apparently wrote many of his own lines, including the anti-Italian speech.
- The boat used in the film (the Mosholu) is now a floating restaurant in Penn's Landing, 'Philadelphia'.
- Danny Aiello ad-libbed 'he had lived' because he needed a line to get his SAG card.
- Talia Shire's idea to change the miscarriage to an abortion; Coppola loved it.
- James Caan returned as Sonny only if paid the same amount as the first movie.
(Probably) unanswerable questions
- Did Pacino actually hit Diane Keaton in the abortion scene?
- Was Michael justified in murdering Fredo?
- Would Fredo have betrayed the family again if allowed to live?
- Is the Saga (chronological order) actually the best way to watch?
- Bill's theory: Did Fredo create the 'Hail Mary' in football? (connecting Fredo's prayer to the 1975 Drew Pearson play).
Who won the movie?
- Brian Koppelman: Coppola – confirmation as one of the 10 most important filmmakers ever.
- Bill: Pacino – greatest performance ever.
- Chris: Tom Hagen / Robert Duvall as 'the soul of the movie.'
- Also argued: De Niro (announced himself as next major movie star), Lee Strasberg (proved a teacher can perform at the highest level).